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Thread: going to Heaven ?

  1. #51
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    Orangetom,

    “God has two witnesses since the end of the nation Israel...in 70 AD.....His Word and His Church.....of every kindred and tongue on the earth...”
    This statement alone proves you have no understanding of who Elijah is.. Have you not noticed? The nation of Israel Lives! The People of Israel Live! Jerusalem is they're capital... I explained to you why. You apparently didn't understand. If you wish I could write a very long seas about it....So, what was Elijah's Name before he was a prophet? You don't know. Seems kinda hard for you to not admit to the fact you aren't the expert here.

    “Paul...the Apostle to the Gentiles clears up for us who and what is Ishmael in Galatians Chapter 4..in allegory...which things are an allegory....”
    I guess you haven't grasped the fact, no one cares about Paul. Paul didn't even live in the time of Jesus. He isn't even close to what the apostles who knew him had to say. The Original Christian church from Jerusalem had to keep sending folks behind him to correct his wrongs.

    “The Noontide laws are not mentioned by that name in the Olde Testament....nor is the Talmud... nor the Kabbalah...,.all traditions of men..”
    The Noahide Laws are mentioned. Noah being one of the “good man” in his day. Might be way they give him the honor of being put with those rules.
    The Only Testament, Talmud and Kabbalah Only a fool would call them traditions of men! Again another point of you having no clue as to what you speak. I am not an expert in all of those fields. Yet I have trained under some who are. I have a much higher level of knowledge than most. In fact I could go and take the Rabbinical Exam and probably pass.

    “Non Hebrews are supposed to know nothing about these traditions of men and many of our ministers do not cover this material.purpose..leaving their flocks unarmored....untutored...”
    As not funny as this is. I have yet to meet anyone who claims to be a “Christian” and knows anything about what I have been trying to explain to you. Especially your Pastors. You can not teach what you don't know.... I have ran into several who thought they were experts and quit rapidly found out they were not. Oral Roberts University. One of they're Hebrew Only Testament Professors tried me. He failed quite badly. I'm guessing the old saying those that can not do teach.

    “Once again...i am not under the Olde Testament bondage...Ishmael.....but I am to know the Olde Testament as my schoolmaster to know what came before..

    For I am under Grace and not Law...”
    The Only Testament is here for ever and ever. Well G-D is not a Mortal that he should lie nor is he Man that he should change his mind.... I can show you every rule. I can show you were every single one is. Including the Noahide Laws for you Non-Jews.
    Please, Please stand up in your Church and tell your Minister when they are asking for tithes and offerings, that silliness there. Under grace and not Law!!! I might even be willing to send you a donation if you video tape it for us!!!!


    “For the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob is the same from the Olde Testament unto the New Testament...”

    Abraham, Isaac and Jacob prayed to and worshiped one G-D... Hence the reasons they are a Monotheistic Religion. You New wannabe Jews, pray to the trinity. So Please stope tying to tie yourseves to the Jewish Nation. Abraham, Isaac and Jacob G-D has brought the Jewsih Nation back to the Land promised to Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, with Jerusalem as its capital...How do you think Less than 6 million Jews defeted 600 million Muslims??? You think it was Luck??? No, NO, NO, It was the G-D of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. The people who are following the laws of G-D. The Jews who don't follow G-Ds law disappear from this world.

    Finris

  2. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by finris View Post
    bambam,

    I think this little articl explains things better than I. Please be reminded I did admit to having dates and such wrong.


    https://io9.gizmodo.com/the-very-sho...apture-5928190

    Pastor John Hagee has written many good books on end times , and the rapture. One I highly recommend is titled , " Beginning of the End " .

    P.S. I am not a " wannabe Jew " . I believe in the New Testament and I believe Jesus is the son of God .
    Last edited by bambam; 02-27-2021 at 01:41 PM.

  3. #53
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    Finris,

    You New wannabe Jews, pray to the trinity. So Please stope tying to tie yourseves to the Jewish Nation. Abraham, Isaac and Jacob G-D has brought the Jewsih Nation back to the Land promised to Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, with Jerusalem as its capital
    I am not interested in tying myself to the Jewish Nation....I am interested in tying myself to Gods Way.....and Word....,

    My Jerusalem is above and the mother of us all....not the Jerusalem here on this earth...not difficult to figure out. And Paul clears this up for us in Galatians Chapter 4.

    Oh...and to my recollection ...the Hebrew religious leaders knew of the triune God....this is not a new thing with Christians...not new at all..


    The Only Testament is here for ever and ever. Well G-D is not a Mortal that he should lie nor is he Man that he should change his mind.
    The Olde Testament is here forever as part of His Word...that we should know what came before...

    As to changing His mind....I will remind you that a Testament is a promise...a will and testament...and a testator can change the testament or promise/covenant as often as they like as they live.

    This is historically known among many many peoples and nations...

    The event which brings the last will and testament into effect is the death of the testator....and no one died for the Olde Testament. This is clear to people who understand this about customs and history.

    Again the testator can change their will and testament or promise...covenant as often as they like ....this Finris...is sovereignty.......and God is Sovereign and we are subject....

    A Sovereign God...



    One of the traits unknown by way to many today...is the Occult doctrine that someone or some group is trying to restore something from the past that was so great they are going to bring it back and put everyone else under their control.....

    This Finris...is the New World Order....via the Deep State.....It is Nimrod...Babylon..and others who have tried it under one empire after another ..after another with at least 7 world empires recorded..in most of history.

    The Hebrews are trying to do the same with their Occult practices and the Noahide laws are a variation of this occult pattern which they bought into in captivity in Babylon....via the Babylonian Talmud to which they were introduced...

    There are others in this world following a similar pattern of "Restoration" of something in the past which was so great they need to bring it back and bring everyone under their authority...

    Masonry is just such an pattern...."The Restoration of the True Brotherhood." And these people and groups are Talmudic as well. The Hebrews are not the only ones who follow the Talmud...a standard for the insiders and another standard for the outsiders or Goyim....or Profane.. Occult Masons are also into the Kaballah....
    I busted out laughing when it was announced in the news that Madonna was studying Kaballah.



    We are not supposed to know these things even exist....

    Mormonism is just such an Talmudic system and is also clandestine Masonry....a standard for the insiders or Saints and another standard for the outsiders...
    Most people do not know the symbol upon their holy underwear.


    The amount left out of our educations is very telling and also very very difficult to find teachers who will educate you on this.

    Not every Jew follows the Talmud...so one must needs be careful here...Karaite Jews do not follow the Talmud...and this too is not known by many.

    Astonishing to me that my own beloved sister and her husband who study Judaism extensively....do not know about the Karaite Jews..


    Oh...and it is not Judiasm...it should be Mosesism..after the Law of Moses...Judisam is a modern adaptation after the loss of the Temple and Priesthood, land..sacrifice in 70 ad...

    Finris ....I check up on Ministers as I am taught by certain Elders to do...and have caught many of them leaving out certain things from the Olde and New Testaments as well as secular history for our educations....Knowledges.

    Many of our Christian Ministers are taking the Salt out of Christianity and have been doing this for a long long time now..


    Once again..I am not under the bondage of the Olde Testament..not under Ishmael....any attempt to bring back the Olde Testament way and practice including the Noahide Laws is Ishmael...and not Isaac..


    And very very few ministers I've met teach what I know about Galatians Chapter 4...and for good reason....they are substituting a Talmudic religion for Christianity....

    And many Christians have never been taught this as well.


    Oh...and one more thing....I do not believe in the Rapture....and also know it is not in His Word by that name..


    My non Ishmaelite .02,
    Orangetom
    Last edited by orangetom1999; 03-01-2021 at 06:11 AM.

  4. #54
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    Oh....and to follow up your post Finris....on the Rapture...

    I am familiar with that version concerning Margret McDonald as well as John Darby's involvement having been so taught by certain Elders in The Church. Also I have been taught by the same Elders on the Schofield Bible...

    Nonetheless..I do not believe in the Rapture ....nor by that name...nor Margret McDonald and John Darby.



    I do not believe most Christians today have ever heard of John Darby nor Margret McDonald and that version of history.


    Thanks,
    Orangetom
    Not an Ishmaelite
    Last edited by orangetom1999; 03-02-2021 at 12:39 PM.

  5. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by bambam View Post
    Pastor John Hagee has written many good books on end times , and the rapture. One I highly recommend is titled , " Beginning of the End " .

    P.S. I am not a " wannabe Jew " . I believe in the New Testament and I believe Jesus is the son of God .
    Sorry about my absance.

    I have read a bit of Hagee has written. I have also read a bit from some of his peers. Hagee has written some that I might agree with. Yet, alot I think he has wrong. But, With out a doubt his stuff is better than many of his Peers.
    I can say I have read about Rapture some. Make no Mistake I'm not any expert, or even a basic person when it comes to the books your into.
    I find that the vast majority of "Pastors", can't seem to grasp the Original Testament. I see them trying to make hide and hair of it to try and connect it to things that do not have a connection.

    Please Dear Sir, go forth and believe what ever makes you happy.

  6. #56
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    Its true the word "rapture" doesn't appear in the bible, but the Apostle Paul references such in I Corinthians, Ch 15: vs 51-54. Then, in I Thessalonians, Ch 4: vs 13-17 Paul spells it out rather consisely, a vivid description of what to expect. I'm not going to quote it, but for those who are interested I've given the scripture. And, as Jesus said on numerous occassions, he who has ears to hear, let him hear.

  7. #57
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    Its true the word "rapture" doesn't appear in the bible, but the Apostle Paul references such in I Corinthians, Ch 15: vs 51-54. Then, in I Thessalonians, Ch 4: vs 13-17 Paul spells it out rather consisely, a vivid description of what to expect.

    I Thessalonians, Ch 4

    vs 13: I would not have you to be ignorant, bretheren, concerning them which are asleep, that ye sorrow not, even as others which have no hope.

    vs 14: For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them which sleep in Jesus will God bring with Him.

    vs 15: For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.

    vs 16: For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God, and the dead in Christ shall rise first:

    vs 17: Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air, and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

    vs 18: Wherefore comfort one another with these words.

    This describes what will happen with those of us who have given our hearts and lives to Jesus. It won't be the same for those who have rejected Him. For we, indeed, are NOT all His children. We are all His creation, but He has given us a way to become children of the living God. He also gave us the freedom to choose ,of our own volition, which way we wanted to go. He also tells us the consequence of each choice. As Jesus said on numerous occassions; "he who has ears to hear, let him hear." Are you listening?

  8. #58
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    “I am not interested in tying myself to the Jewish Nation....I am interested in tying myself to Gods Way.....and Word....,

    My Jerusalem is above and the mother of us all....not the Jerusalem here on this earth...not difficult to figure out. And Paul clears this up for us in Galatians Chapter 4.

    Oh...and to my recollection ...the Hebrew religious leaders knew of the triune God....this is not a new thing with Christians...not new at all..”

    Why Christians constantly say “Hasus” is the Jewish nations Messiah. The Jews don't recognize him. We do and so we have replaced the Jewish nation as G-D's People. This is known as replacement theology.
    If you want to attach yourself to G-D's way why are you not keeping the Laws laid down in the Bible? IF you don't grasp the Only Testament, how are you attaching yourself to his word?

    Jerusalem doesn't belong to you. Obviously you don't grasp the whole issue here. Everything in this world is also in the heavens. The whole point of the having a Messiah. The whole job of the Messiah is to rectify the sin of Adam and Eve... That is to bring the physical and Spiritual world back to one....So, again Jerusalem doesn't belong to you. Jerusalem is G-D's city.

    Moses was the redeemer of the Jewish Nation. He didn't get to be called the Redeemer until he had completed the Job. No one to my knowledge has put the world back into the preSin of Adam and Eve. Until that happens no one can call themselves the Messiah. Do you understand??

    Paul and the book of Galoshes. I have looked at my Bible and can't find that book anywhere.... I don't have a Book of Mormon to check for you. Yes, Paul has the same level of integrity as the Book of Mormon...

    “The Olde Testament is here forever as part of His Word...that we should know what came before...

    As to changing His mind....I will remind you that a Testament is a promise...a will and testament...and a testator can change the testament or promise/covenant as often as they like as they live.

    This is historically known among many many peoples and nations...

    The event which brings the last will and testament into effect is the death of the testator....and no one died for the Olde Testament. This is clear to people who understand this about customs and history.

    Again the testator can change their will and testament or promise...covenant as often as they like ....this Finris...is sovereignty.......and God is Sovereign and we are subject....

    A Sovereign God...”


    Okay, how many thinking errors did we make with these thoughts...
    How many covenants did G-D have with the Jewish Nation? Oh but I”m sure you think those can be broken as well. Sorry, NO. More thinking errors. IF you are gonna be talking about Greek or these Roman “pagan gods”. The Jewish nation has only one G-D. So, Jewish G-D is perfect. He makes no mistakes. He doesn't have to do anything over. You know the All Seeing, All Knowing G-D. Again G-D doesn't change his mind nor does he Lie! Why? G-D doesn't make mistakes....Yes those pagan gods of man do. The G-D of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob/Israel has a covenant with them and they're descendants. If you have ever read the process of the Abraham Covenant what is said? I recall this shall be done through out your generations!! I don't see him saying anything about it ending??? Where is that at? I have never seen that. Maybe the “book of mOrmon” stuff again???



    “One of the traits unknown by way to many today...is the Occult doctrine that someone or some group is trying to restore something from the past that was so great they are going to bring it back and put everyone else under their control.....

    This Finris...is the New World Order....via the Deep State.....It is Nimrod...Babylon..and others who have tried it under one empire after another ..after another with at least 7 world empires recorded..in most of history.

    The Hebrews are trying to do the same with their Occult practices and the Noahide laws are a variation of this occult pattern which they bought into in captivity in Babylon....via the Babylonian Talmud to which they were introduced...

    There are others in this world following a similar pattern of "Restoration" of something in the past which was so great they need to bring it back and bring everyone under their authority...

    Masonry is just such an pattern...."The Restoration of the True Brotherhood." And these people and groups are Talmudic as well. The Hebrews are not the only ones who follow the Talmud...a standard for the insiders and another standard for the outsiders or Goyim....or Profane.. Occult Masons are also into the Kabbalah...
    I busted out laughing when it was announced in the news that Madonna was studying Kabbalah”


    Again attempting to put Judaism into the Occult....Whoa, hold onto that load of BS. If you are attempting to put any of Judaism's books into the Occult. I would say you have never read any of them. You might want to take that load back to the Proctologist where you got that!!!!
    The Mason books are into the Occult. The have nothing to do with Kabbalah
    Madonna was attempting to learn Kabbalah What Madonna was doing was attempting to learn Jewish Meditation. Why because she doesn't keep kosher. She elevates her soul, yet can't keep it at a higher level due to her lack of Keeping a spiritual height. So all this does is act like drugs. She is getting a spiritual height and then crashing. If she kept Kosher she might be able to stay at a higher level of spiritual level.

    You should go and learn about Judaism. I have discussed what the Talmud is. You failed to understand what I have written. Attempting to apply anything from Judaism to the Occult is, or should be below you. If you deny Judaism, you deny your own religion. Yet, replacement theology is the attempt to deny Judaism. The “church” has tried to wipe Jews out. The “church” has attempted many times to deny Judaism, and to call them the murders of the Messiah. All types of cabal. You should relearn some things. These Conspiracy stuff is benith you. Next you will attempt to deny Jews are not Indigenous to the Middle East. Yet they are.


    Sorry for making you wait. I have been busy.

    Finris

  9. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by beowulf View Post
    Its true the word "rapture" doesn't appear in the bible, but the Apostle Paul references such in I Corinthians, Ch 15: vs 51-54. Then, in I Thessalonians, Ch 4: vs 13-17 Paul spells it out rather consisely, a vivid description of what to expect.

    I Thessalonians, Ch 4

    vs 13: I would not have you to be ignorant, bretheren, concerning them which are asleep, that ye sorrow not, even as others which have no hope.

    vs 14: For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them which sleep in Jesus will God bring with Him.

    vs 15: For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.

    vs 16: For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God, and the dead in Christ shall rise first:

    vs 17: Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air, and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

    vs 18: Wherefore comfort one another with these words.

    This describes what will happen with those of us who have given our hearts and lives to Jesus. It won't be the same for those who have rejected Him. For we, indeed, are NOT all His children. We are all His creation, but He has given us a way to become children of the living God. He also gave us the freedom to choose ,of our own volition, which way we wanted to go. He also tells us the consequence of each choice. As Jesus said on numerous occassions; "he who has ears to hear, let him hear." Are you listening?
    My quote beow.

    "How many covenants did G-D have with the Jewish Nation? Oh but I”m sure you think those can be broken as well. Sorry, NO. More thinking errors. IF you are gonna be talking about Greek or these Roman “pagan gods”. The Jewish nation has only one G-D. So, Jewish G-D is perfect. He makes no mistakes. He doesn't have to do anything over. You know the All Seeing, All Knowing G-D. Again G-D doesn't change his mind nor does he Lie! Why? G-D doesn't make mistakes....Yes those pagan gods of man do. The G-D of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob/Israel has a covenant with them and they're descendants. If you have ever read the process of the Abraham Covenant what is said? I recall this shall be done through out your generations!! I don't see him saying anything about it ending??? Where is that at? I have never seen that. Maybe the “book of mOrmon” stuff again???"
    Moses was the redeemer of the Jewish Nation. He didn't get to be called the Redeemer until he had completed the Job. No one to my knowledge has put the world back into the preSin of Adam and Eve. Until that happens no one can call themselves the Messiah. Do you understand??

    Paul and the book of Galoshes. I have looked at my Bible and can't find that book anywhere.... I don't have a Book of Mormon to check for you. Yes, Paul has the same level of integrity as the Book of Mormon...
    When Paul was in Rome. He made a statement about “nothing unclean has ever passed my lips”. What that means is he was keeping Kosher. He was staying with the Jews in the Jewish quarter. Paul wasn't staying with the “Christians” or eating with them. So Paul wasn't teaching about how to keep Kosher. Paul didn't teach the new religion how to do the Covenant of Abraham “Circumcision”. I also realize what is really wrong with things is where are all the “books” of the 12 apostols? Why are so many of the nonconformist books written by Paul? Paul wasn't even alive during the time of Jesus.
    Paul was keeping the Laws. Yet he failed to teach them to the new found religion. The original church founded in Jerusalem, was always sending 2 witnesses to correct Paul's stuff. Please don't take my word for it. Go and do your own research. Pray on your own for your own answers.

    Just remember even G-D is sending 2 witnesses at the end... Well Jewish Law requires a minimum of 2....Paul went alone.

    Sorry about the slow response time. I'm trying to get to everyone in order.

  10. #60
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    Apologizes to all. I have been to busy to answer your thoughts on this discussion I do enjoy chatting about things. If I have missed something, Please let me know. I wasn't trying to be harsh to anyone with my responses If you took them that way.
    Again Please accept My Apologizes
    Finris

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