2 way radio questions.

[clubster]

I am thinking about getting a pair of two way radios for emergency should our cell phones go out. I would prefer a AA powered 30 mile handheld 2 way. Who makes the best one or is there a better alternative? I am wanting to keep them in the car.

[BigJohn]

Finding a handheld radio that transmits 30 miles is gonna be really tough. You could do this of course if you were using a Ham radio through a repeater but simplex (radio to radio) probably ain't gonna happen. Most any handheld you will find would only put out 5 watts of power and 5 watts on an FM handheld isn't much for that distance. BTW, those advertisers who claim 20 miles on a Family Service Radio from Wally World are full of BS. It should be against the law to advertise this because it doesn't happen in the real world.
You might check your area and see if there are any GMRS repeaters. You might make a deal with the owner to let you use it. This would be UHF FM and would compound the simplex idea but a repeater is your only choice for a handheld at that distance. Now, if you wanted to get a mobile mounted in your car your chances would be much better although still not guaranteed.


BJ

[clubster]

I guess basically what I had in mind is that my wife is a homemaker and my office is about 20 miles from home. If something should happen and cells phones are out I would like to get a hold of her should she be in the car or at home. What to do? I want something to use for emergencies and thats about.

[BigJohn]

in the way of radios that don't require a license. If you go with business band you need one the same as you do for Ham which I assume neither of you has.
Without telling you to do something against the law, you could shop around on E-Bay and find a couple of used kenwood TK-780H radio's . These work in the VHF band and you could have some business band freqs programmed in them. They put out about 45 watts and VHF is much better than UHF for this kind of thing. They would require mounting in the car and an external antenna but you could use a mag mount and a quick power disconnect if you wanted to keep them stashed in the trunk. This would require you to teach the operator how to hook it up but it's really simple. You can also have the weather band programmed in just in case.


BJ

[MiniDevil]

I really don't think you are ever going to find a handheld that really does that. They may advertise it, but it aint gonna happen. 30 miles is a long long stretch even for a peaked and tuned vehicle mounted CB running without an amplifier. They do make CBs that convert from vehicle mount to handheld but you are still going to lose a lot of range.

[bob200587]

I would recommend a set of good GMRS/FRS Cobra radios, with NOAA weather radio if you can find them. Range isn't that great, but I'm not really sure exactly what you are wanting.

[MiniDevil]

I would recommend a set of good GMRS/FRS Cobra radios, with NOAA weather radio if you can find them. Range isn't that great, but I'm not really sure exactly what you are wanting.

Sounds like he wants an alternative to a cell phone. Small, portable, and able to talk 30 miles.

[BigJohn]

I am thinking about getting a pair of two way radios for emergency should our cell phones go out. I would prefer a AA powered 30 mile handheld 2 way. Who makes the best one or is there a better alternative? I am wanting to keep them in the car.

PM me and I will give you the scoop on how to get it done.

BJ

[kirgi08]

I guess basically what I had in mind is that my wife is a homemaker and my office is about 20 miles from home. If something should happen and cells phones are out I would like to get a hold of her should she be in the car or at home. What to do? I want something to use for emergencies and thats about.

OK folks been out of the game for awhile.A SSB CB should handle that prob.You get a/n Semi secure channel and if'n you have your speak rt you can and will get your point across.'08.

[cd45]

I have not found a hand held radio that will talk to 30 miles. If there is one, let me know, I want it. I got my Tech license in May, and immediately bought 2 hand helds and two mobile radios. One went in the car and the other is being used as a base station. I am only able to get 10 to 12 miles with the hand held radios, and that is not hand held to hand held, that is from the hand held to my base with the tall antenna.

[RedNeckSCOUT]

I have not found a hand held radio that will talk to 30 miles. If there is one, let me know, I want it. I got my Tech license in May, and immediately bought 2 hand helds and two mobile radios. One went in the car and the other is being used as a base station. I am only able to get 10 to 12 miles with the hand held radios, and that is not hand held to hand held, that is from the hand held to my base with the tall antenna.

what do you get handheld to handheld?:scratch:

[wy0mn]

Thirty miles is a practical upper limit for line of sight, unless your speaking from mountain-top to valley below.
As a former QRP'er I can tell you that low watt radios are improved tremendously by antenna selection alone. A directional antenna at your home, and one with you... might work. Its all I can think of legally.

[dblnaught]

Inverted V HF?

[Kicker]

I am thinking about getting a pair of two way radios for emergency should our cell phones go out. I would prefer a AA powered 30 mile handheld 2 way. Who makes the best one or is there a better alternative? I am wanting to keep them in the car.

I have a set of Motorola two way and they are rated for over 28 miles but that is on flat open land I get about 2-3 miles with mine in the woods. which is good if you ask me.

[Kicker]

Thirty miles is a practical upper limit for line of sight, unless your speaking from mountain-top to valley below.
As a former QRP'er I can tell you that low watt radios are improved tremendously by antenna selection alone. A directional antenna at your home, and one with you... might work. Its all I can think of legally.
can you peak thees like a cb I have my CB putting out like 20 watts they say 30 but I don't believe it

[Draven Azropht]

OK heres a improvised idea...

A) use a CB radio with a power pack and a high end antenna. This would be very bulky but allow for a moble base station like set up.

b) Use a CB radio with power pack and linear signal booster, again its gonna be bulky and the signal booster is often illegal. But, used in combination with a wire and balloon to get the antenna above the trees.

Either way your talking about a backpack carry compared to and simple hand-mic.

[alpmco]

But, used in combination with a wire and balloon to get the antenna above the trees.
WTF??? Wire and balloon? Great as long as you don't intend to transmit!
For transmission an antenna has to be cut to length to match the frequency. Yeah, I know that's oversimplified. Plus with a 1/4 wave vertical you will need a ground radial (like the roof or your car) or dump the vertical and go with a dipole.

[Draven Azropht]

Well I somewhat over simplified but it can work in theory, I'm actually basing the idea of something the French resistance did during WW2. Using the Wire as an Antenna but their is an issue of digital Vs analog. I don't know if it will work with digital or what kind of output it will have.

[alpmco]

It could be done. You could make a dipole out of a length of coax by stripping back the shield from the core for the desired frequency. For 11 meter (CB) band that would be an exposed center conductor of 103.2" with the shield rolled back over the coax outer insulator the same distance. Overall length would be 17.2 feet. That is based on a frequency of 27.207 MHz (channel 20) Crimp a lug to the end of the center conductor and hoist it up. That would bee too heavy for the typical helium balloon. It is doable.
I have done this with a 2M HT radio in the forest. Slingshot with a lead weight and fishing line up into the tree then hoist the antenna up. But the 2M (144.0 MHz) is only 38 inches overall.

[Joe Botz]

buy a mobile ham radio and a based station its your best bet,,,don't worry about a license,,get on on the internet ie. ebay etc. The FCC is not triangulating and looking for you. just have it for an emergency. Don't use it for a cell phone for comm.

[alpmco]

buy a mobile ham radio and a based station its your best bet,,,don't worry about a license,,get on on the internet ie. ebay etc. The FCC is not triangulating and looking for you. just have it for an emergency. Don't use it for a cell phone for comm.
No the FCC does not specifically triangulate unlicensed operators on amateur frequencies ... BUT they let the Amateur Axillary do it. These are like FCC enforcer wannabees and they have the backing of the FCC. They take great pride in tracking down (Fox Hunting) unlicensed users and then they bring in the big boys. It is a game to them and they take it serious and the results are fines or imprisonment and loss of equipment.

As easy as it is to get a license ... about a week of study and $15 for the test ... just get the damn license and be legal! If you have an ounce of common scene, can count to twenty and divide by 246 you can pass the Technician classification.

[Lone Eagle]

Most FRS radios are good for 2-3 miles at best in the woods, 1 mile LOS urban, and up to 30 in open area, like a desert. I have a set of Cobra FRS-130's, but these are strictly for vehicle-to-vehicle comm.

[alpmco]

The FRS radios are highly overrated with the range. Yeah, you might get 10 - 20 miles at sea or the desert but not in typical use. That antenna and power output are the big limitation. That said ... in our club Jeeping adventures in the Ocala Forest and Richloam area I have discovered the FRS tend to have a better range than most of the "off the shelf" CB radios.
Another down side of the FRS for Jeeping is the poor audio output. You need headphones to hear it above the roar of the motor. Plus I've had two bounce out of the Jeep. Still, as a trail ride leader with 30 Jeeps it is good to use them to communicate with my helpers in the line and get around the CB conjestion.

[mr slow]

I have 6 sets and all my friends in my group have Nextel phones and 2 way Motorola radios.Some of the guys are in construction jobs and they use Nextel phones which work great. I have use them on the job until we went with phones.They are great to use in a large complex and are easy to use. When we carvan on fishing trips we use the Motorola radios to keep our groups together.We decided to use Nextel phones, so we all went out and bought them.

[alpmco]

Problem with Nextel or any GSM service is it is dependent on the network. They can't stand alone. Too many places I go have no service in the best of times much less SHTF. The cell phones were out three days in our area after hurricane Charlie.
Tin foil hat time ... how easy is it for FEMA or any gov agency to pull the plug on they system?

[Lone Eagle]

Problem with Nextel or any GSM service is it is dependent on the network. They can't stand alone. Too many places I go have no service in the best of times much less SHTF. The cell phones were out three days in our area after hurricane Charlie.
Tin foil hat time ... how easy is it for FEMA or any gov agency to pull the plug on they system?

Under Martial Law........easy as a memo. All they have to do is commandeer all the cell towers for "Official Use Only", and there goes your Blackberry out the window. This is why I have the FRS radios.

Also remember, ANY phone with a GPS locator, dubbed for 911 use, can be a red flare for you if SHTF.

[AirGunner]

Have any of you guys considered eXrs made by TriSquare (exterme radio service)? It's a 900mhz Frequency Hopping Spectrum Spread radio. (Similar to HaveQuick or SINGCARS, just not encryptable.) You can get them at Best Buy or the BX like I got mine. They are just a powerful as GMRS/FRS radios and the best part is you don't need a liscense. You can select, on certain models, up to 10 million channels, that you can enter manually when you program the radio. Additionally, since it's frequency hopping, it makes it eavesdropping on your conversations almost impossible. Now during a SHTF situation, ISR assets could still try to DF fix your position. But due to the frequency hopping, it makes that job harder. Just some food for thought. :p

[alpmco]

Have any of you guys considered eXrs made by TriSquare (exterme radio service)? It's a 900mhz Frequency Hopping Spectrum Spread radio.
Yes! It appears to be a very good system. In fact the company is the one that produced most of the early FRS radios. Then the other companies joined the FRS boom and started making outrageous claims on range. So they went on to develop this new system

[cwillis]

do you guys remembr years back if you were a first responder/military/law enforecement you could get a little red button on your nextel phone that kicked people off the tower giving you priority. . .

they dont do it anymore, at least on such a large scale. . . but i want one.


EDIT: found it http://nextelonline.nextel.com/assets/pdfs/en/solutions/case_studies/wireless_priority_service.pdf

[Johnny Ringo]

Whats the best brand of gmrs to have,durability wise?

[BobS]

Motorola Commercial radio, like MT100, Sabre, and the like. Bubble packs are toys.

Best regards,

Bob

[Johnny Ringo]

Is there a viable link available, to say purchase?

[BobS]

Check eBay-search Motorola MT1000-you will get a few there. There are 16 channels for GMRS in the UHF band. Be aware these will need to be programmed for the frequencies and should be tuned for peak performance.

Not my installation but the same equipment I use in my trucks:

http://www.repeater-builder.com/motorola/genesis/mva/ntn6513-2.jpg

The MT1000 is removable from the MVA (Motorola's term for the mobile control head and charger) by pushing in on the thumbpad on the right in that picture and raising it so the radio unplugs from the socket. You will need a mobile antenna (I use Antenex "transit" style UHF antenna mounted to the roof in an NMO mount (permanent mount-means you have to drill thru the roof to install) and cable to run from the MVA to the antenna.

I also use the 99 chan MT shown in the picture (I cover both GMRS and some ham repeaters as well as IRLP ham link frequencies on mine) instead of the 16 channel MT.
Best regards,

Bob

ADDENDUM: For info on the Genesis see http://www.repeater-builder.com/motorola/genesis/mva-overview.html (where the above pic came from) and http://www.repeater-builder.com/motorola/genesis/genesis-index.html . The MT1000 operator's guide is located at http://www.repeater-builder.com/motorola/genesis/pdfs/mt1000-operating-instructions.pdf . Many hams would prefer the Sabre, but personally, the MT100 does everything I want without the extra cost of the Sabre-but be aware it IS older than the Sabre-a full generation radio behind the Sabre. Just decide what you want to do then and only then select a radio. Others like the GE, the EF Johnson, some like the Kenwood (Standard) or the ICOM commercial radios...personal preferance. I have friends that are capable of repairing and programming my MT's for a pittance.....of course, there is the issue of tit for tat.....LOL.

[BobS]

http://cgi.ebay.com/6-Motorola-MT1000-UHF-16-Channels_W0QQitemZ390009359516QQihZ026QQcategoryZ2 96QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem Set of 6 Moto MT1000 UHF w/gang charger $500.00 (roughly)

http://cgi.ebay.com/Motorola-MT1000-UHF-16-Channels_W0QQitemZ200276796501QQihZ010QQcategoryZ2 96QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem Single MT w/individual charger $150.00 (roughly)

http://cgi.ebay.com/Motorola-MT1000-radios-SIX-in-rack-charger-new-batts_W0QQitemZ150311063162QQihZ005QQcategoryZ2038 3QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem 6 with new batteries and gang charger $300.00 (roughly)

http://cgi.ebay.com/Mt1000-99-chanl-display-MVA-Police-Fire-amp-Uhf-Vhf_W0QQitemZ180307486374QQihZ008QQcategoryZ46539Q QssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem Full MVA with amplifier $120.00 roughly

Best regards,

Bob

[wolfracer]

Any Idea how much replacement batteries are ? Those are sweet radios. We use those in our Fire Dept.

[BobS]

I got some Moto batterys for (I believe) $40.00 each. This is a little more than the aftermarket ones you can get from various eBay sellers. You just have to watch the type of batteries in the aftermarket and the watt hour rating to make sure they match.

Best regards,

Bob

[Paladin]

I have not found a hand held radio that will talk to 30 miles. If there is one, let me know, I want it. I got my Tech license in May, and immediately bought 2 hand helds and two mobile radios. One went in the car and the other is being used as a base station. I am only able to get 10 to 12 miles with the hand held radios, and that is not hand held to hand held, that is from the hand held to my base with the tall antenna.

CD look up the repeaters in your area, get the input and output frequencies and the pl access tone and you should be all set.

[alpmco]

I have not found a hand held radio that will talk to 30 miles. If there is one, let me know, I want it. <...> I am only able to get 10 to 12 miles with the hand held radios, and that is not hand held to hand held, that is from the hand held to my base with the tall antenna.
You won't find an HT that gets 30 miles HT to HT. VHF is generally (except rare occasions) line of sight. The horizon is roughly 11 miles so that is the expected range of the radio no matter how much power you pump into it. HTs a typically limited to 5 watts.
so to get more range you have to raise the antenna. The higher the antenna at the TX and RX sight the greater the range. That is why most of us use repeaters. Through repeaters (with the repeater antenna up at 300 ft) I have often talked to someone as far as 70 miles form me. We were both on opposite ends of the repeater radius. That was a rarity, most of my repeater comms are within 25 - 30 miles. We have a new repeater here that has it's antenna up at 1,200 feet. I have yet to test it's range but is should be good out to 50 - 70 miles radius.
For SHTF communications don't depend on the repeaters being there. Plan on simplex, troposcatter or EME. Figure your VHF / UHF comms to be reliable out to about 10 miles.
This is why I went for my General license a couple months ago. I'm building my HF setup a piece at a time. All that is left is the antenna. I'll probably buy one but I want to make my own too. Lots to learn.

[Tdale]

I am thinking about getting a pair of two way radios for emergency should our cell phones go out. I would prefer a AA powered 30 mile handheld 2 way. Who makes the best one or is there a better alternative? I am wanting to keep them in the car.

As others have said you will not get 30+ miles out of a HT in simplex mode. but if there is a GMRS repeater close to you it should be no problem with a 5 watt radio

for my SHTF HT's I went with UHF Puxing radios they are 80 bucks shipped http://www.409shop.com/409shop_product.php?id=103076. I can talk 10+ miles in simplex (depending on terrain) and I have no problems hitting a GMRS repeater over 25 miles away. Of course I'm using a vehicle antenna with the HT's to get this range, with the stock rubber ducky antenna my range is shorter.

Or there is always the option of getting your tech class amateur license, this opens up the 2 meter and 70cm bands and there are tons of 2 meter and 70cm repeaters out there. If you need 30+ miles without the aid of a repeater then a mobile radio with 50 watts should fit the bill. Of course terrain will play a factor because these frequencies are sort of line of sight, so if there is a mountain between you and the person your trying to talk to your out of luck in simplex.

[WQJD271]

I have read stories of 100 mile range with GMRS HT using a simplex repeater and one HT attached to a helium or Hot air ballon.
One poster did not tether the ballon and and claimed 300 mile range and 80,000 Ft elevation. I have not experienced this myself.
I just purchased a simplex repeater and set of two 4W HT's and will be doing a few experiments of my own.

When hitting a regular repeater in my area I can talk with others more than 35-40 miles away (but if the power grid fails these will not work) I currently get about 4-5 miles in suburban area with my HT's alone.

Like some other posters here my wife is not really onboard and thinks I am a bit looney to even consider that the grid could go down. (electric or cell phone) I know though that on the outside chance that it does we will still be able to communicate.

[alpmco]

I have read stories of 100 mile range with GMRS HT using a simplex repeater and one HT attached to a helium or Hot air ballon.
One poster did not tether the ballon and and claimed 300 mile range and 80,000 Ft elevation.
Well that ain't your typical helium or hot air balloon! 80,000 feet!?! That takes a special balloon.

[bac0nfat]

30 miles handheld, no way. You need a repeater with at least 100 watts depending on your terrain. You will need an antenna with a lot of gain such as a stationmaster and a high point to mount it to. Check out the Motorola Trbo system if you want a good one for under the $5,000 range. Also you will need the proper licensing.

[Paladin]

30 miles handheld, no way. You need a repeater with at least 100 watts depending on your terrain. You will need an antenna with a lot of gain such as a stationmaster and a high point to mount it to. Check out the Motorola Trbo system if you want a good one for under the $5,000 range. Also you will need the proper licensing.

Actually you could do 30 miles with an ERP of under five watts, it all depends on antenna location and elevation. Our local wide area repeater system defaults to 25 watts when it kicks to emergency power giving an ERP of just over 10 and we still get a 70 mile radius of coverage. (146.910 mhz)

[alpmco]

Not sure but I think he was referring to the FRS claims. I don't know how the get away with advertising 20 or 30 mile range on the packaging. I guess it is the "up to" part of the claim. Yeah, in unusual circumstances you could get 20 - 30 miles ... but not typically.

[Paladin]

Not sure but I think he was referring to the FRS claims. I don't know how the get away with advertising 20 or 30 mile range on the packaging. I guess it is the "up to" part of the claim. Yeah, in unusual circumstances you could get 20 - 30 miles ... but not typically.

across water probably...

[Tdale]

there is no way any FRS radio from wal-mart is going to get 30 miles in simplex, well maybe if you were in outer space, but it's just not possible in a normal situation. In fact you will be luck to get over 2 miles with a FRS radio.

By law they are limited to 1/2 watt on FRS frequencies. Most FRS radios have the ability to use the GMRS bands and you will get better distance with thoes channels because they are allowed to output 5 watts. but to be legal you need a licenese to use the GMRS band

But you still run into the wal-mart FRS radios biggest weakness and that is it non removable antenna. it's a very inefficient antenna. in fact when using a 5 watt GMRS channel most FRS radios are only putting out about 1 watt of radiated power and 1/10 of a watt on the FRS frequencies

Another problem you will run into is the curvature of the earth. the FRS/GMRS frequencies are pretty much line of sight and do not bounce off the ionosphere like short wave frequencies. So without a repeater most of the time you will be limited to around 10 miles. You can do moonbounce on the FRS/GMRS frequencies, but you need a high gain directional antenna and much more powerful/better quality radio.

If your serious about getting the most distance with a HT, buy one that you can put a good antenna on and i would highly recomend that you get your amateur radio license, it opens up a lot more options

[Paladin]

You are not allowed to alter the antennas on FRS radios either, a true GMRS radio doesnt have this restriction.

[bac0nfat]

Tdale I think you hit the nail on the head. If you want anything other than going car to car when you're following someone, or talking to you neighbor, don't even look at FRS radios. Another problem is security with FRS. Which reminds me, if anyone is interested in encrypted radios let me know, thats what I do for a living.

[Tdale]

i, for one, would be interested in an encrypted radio, but unless there have been some changes in the law it is illegal to transmit an encrypted radio signal on amateur radio frequencies....i dont know about other frequencies, i just have a tech ham licence, would an encrypted radio require a different license?

[mndless]

Ok... guys... for us that have 'zero' knowledge of hand held communications... what is important to me...

1 - Good reliable post SHTF communications...
2 - I only need 10 miles in surburbia...
3 - Reasonable cost...not going to sell my first kid for radios... the wife? maybe... but not the kids..
4 - Family of 5... don't want licenses for everybody.. if I have to fine, but can that be avoided?

So... given the above... how does the average guy pull of good hand held communications when the cell towers go down???

[Tdale]

Assuming repeaters will be down post SHTF the wal-mart FRS/GMRS radios are out of the question. and since you don't want to get licenses for everyone (rules out amateur radio) I would recommend a HAM type radio that will operate on the FRS/GMRS radio frequencies. If you want to be legal you can get the GMRS license, I think it is $85 and good for the whole family.....but to be honest most people dont buy the GMRS license, it's not like there is a GMRS police department out there DFing every GMRS transmission, or there would be a lot of kids in jail for playing with their new walkie talkies.

http://www.409shop.com/409shop_product.php?id=102049 $65 shipped or http://www.409shop.com/409shop_product.php?id=103076 $80 shipped these radios will operate on the FRS/GMRS frequencies. I prefer the $80 one because it has a voice scrambler and you can monitor two frequencies at the same time, but other then that it's the same radio as the $65 one....you'll get the same range. you can use either of them on low power and be legal on FRS. Add a good antenna and go to full power and you should get about a 10 mile range out of both FRS and GMRS frequencies, of course terrain will play a factor.

I have the 888 set up in my truck and another 888 in the wifes car, both with the optional battery eliminator http://www.409shop.com/409shop_product.php?id=101412&usercat=1774 $14 shipped and a +6 db gain vehicle antenna http://www.universal-radio.com/catalog/hamantm/2366.html $75 10 miles is not a problem in simplex with this setup.

The most important factor will be your antenna. with a HT you only have about 5 watts to play with, you need a good antenna to get the most out of your HT. The higher the db gain the better......For portable comms where the stock antenna isn't good enough we each have one of these portable antennas http://www.universal-radio.com/catalog/hamantht/3937.html $20 and a 5.3 db gain, they really increase the distance you get in the woods. If cost is a factor, you could skip the vehicle antenna, and use this one for longer distance comms then the stock rubber ducky antenna.

Incidentially, we keep the radios in an ammo can in our vehicles, they will only be used in an emergency when cell phones are down, the ammo can should provide protection from an EMP should you need the protection. The antennas will not fit in the can, but they will not be effected by an EMP.

hope this helps

Tim

Ok... guys... for us that have 'zero' knowledge of hand held communications... what is important to me...

1 - Good reliable post SHTF communications...
2 - I only need 10 miles in surburbia...
3 - Reasonable cost...not going to sell my first kid for radios... the wife? maybe... but not the kids..
4 - Family of 5... don't want licenses for everybody.. if I have to fine, but can that be avoided?

So... given the above... how does the average guy pull of good hand held communications when the cell towers go down???

[bac0nfat]

i, for one, would be interested in an encrypted radio, but unless there have been some changes in the law it is illegal to transmit an encrypted radio signal on amateur radio frequencies....i dont know about other frequencies, i just have a tech ham licence, would an encrypted radio require a different license?

You just need proper licensing. But encrypted radios are not cheap, ours go for $1,450.00 each, for a complete radio with battery/antenna/charger.

[mndless]

Thanks for the reply Tim...

went back and read through most of the previous posts... again... spent some time reading up on Ham radios and the licensing this morning...

Think I might just break down and get a ham license... can't hurt and I might just learn something... :D

[Tdale]

You just need proper licensing. But encrypted radios are not cheap, ours go for $1,450.00 each, for a complete radio with battery/antenna/charger.

Well I was afraid of that, Well out of my price range, but I'm sure that they would be nice

[Tdale]

Thanks for the reply Tim...

went back and read through most of the previous posts... again... spent some time reading up on Ham radios and the licensing this morning...

Think I might just break down and get a ham license... can't hurt and I might just learn something... :D

Not to mention that an amateur radio license is free and good for 10 years, you only pay a few bucks to take the test. you can go here and see the actual test questions, makes the test pretty easy http://www.qrz.com/testing.html

[bac0nfat]

Well I was afraid of that, Well out of my price range, but I'm sure that they would be nice

Yea I don't control the pricing, but yea I would never pay that much unless I REALLY needed it for some reason.

[alpmco]

... But encrypted radios are not cheap, ours go for $1,450.00 each, for a complete radio with battery/antenna/charger.

That's really cheap compared to getting a typical amateur HF rig up and transmitting! I'm almost at $2k now and I have yet to key up ... all that is left is to string the coax ... I'll be on the air by Christmas!

Assuming repeaters will be down post SHTF the wal-mart FRS/GMRS radios are out of the question. and since you don't want to get licenses for everyone (rules out amateur radio) ... Tim

Well, when TSHTF the license requirement will probably be a moot point. Regulations suspend the license requirement if it is to protect life or property. However you need a license if you want to practice and be ready. Many people do not realize that communications requires practice. Just like using a gun ... anyone can pick up the microphone but if you don't know what you are doing you might just be shooting out into dead air.

[Tdale]

Well, when TSHTF the license requirement will probably be a moot point. Regulations suspend the license requirement if it is to protect life or property. However you need a license if you want to practice and be ready. Many people do not realize that communications requires practice. Just like using a gun ... anyone can pick up the microphone but if you don't know what you are doing you might just be shooting out into dead air. [/QUOTE]

Very true, I have my tech class amateur license and I have found the 2 meter and 70 cm bands to be very active in my area, problem is that i simply cannot get my wife interested in ham radio, she just will not take the test and has no interest in learning ham radio. She did agree that having a back up way of communicating would be a good idea.

So using a ham frequency for back up comms between the both of us isn't going to happen. I am a firm beliver in pratice. A little sweat now will save alot of blood later. I had to find a way to get back up comms and since using the amateur radio frequencies was out of the question (since she will not get a license), i figured GMRS would be the next best thing.

No test for the GMRS license, one simple fee and the whole family can use the license and transmit up to 50 watts. So now pratice between the wife and I is possible. We try to scheduled tests once a month or so to ensure that all is working as it should, and to keep her radio skills up. I get most of my pratice on the 2 meter band on my way to work, but our little tests are all the pratice she gets, but it's much better then no pratice at all. At first I had to call her on her cell phone and talk her thru turning on the radio and going to the correct channel, it would have been a disaster if TSHTF and cell phones were down. Now we have no issues communicating when we switch to SHTF mode;)

Rather then waisting money and attempting the impossible by relying on blister pack radios, I decidend on getting real ham radios that we could use on the GMRS frequencies. I just couldn't afford yaesu or icom radios, or I would have gone with a dual bander like the VX-7R. I did a lot of reading and decided on the Puxings, they are very nice and We've not had any problems with them. We just got the newer 888s to replace our older 777s, i dont know if the voice scrambler will ever come in handy, but its nice to be able to monitor two frequencies at the same time. When we go camping i monitor the kids on one frequency and the wife and I can talk on the other.

Even without getting a GMRS license, one would be okay transmitting on it. Not legal, but there is no enforcement on the GMRS bands. The vast majority of GMRS users do not pay for the license, try that on 2 meter and someone will call for a fox hunt:D

So while getting an amateur license for me and my wife would have been better, GMRS will be more then adequate and we'll get the same distance on GMRS when repeaters go down post SHTF

Tim

[alpmco]

GMRS is good practice for VHF / UHF amateur in that the signals propagate the same way. So it is not a waste ...

[mndless]

k... Bobs has been noticably absent of late... but I would welcome his thoughts on the differences between:

1 - his Motorola hand held/ mobile systems and.

2 - A low end 2m Am. radeo (with decent 144/440 antenna)

I have no basis for the Motorola systems.... good? good enough? range in suburbia?

Can you access ham freqs?

Thanks Bob!

Always appreciated...

[Paladin]

The apropriate Motorola can be programmed for ham frequencies in the given operating band, it will not give you anymore range than a true ham rig putting out equal power into an equal antenna system and it will be more expensive. NOW the question is is it worth the extra cost? Dedicated ham rigs tend to be easier to program for repeaters and various other features due to built in menuing, than the Moto rigs are, however the Motorolas are true professional quality rigs. My personal opinion is that a new ham should startout with true ham equipment, so that they have a chance to take advantage of all the frequencies, and operating features that are available to them, and then after gaining some experience making the step to professional type gear if they so choose. The Moto handhelds are excellent and take more abuse than any ham HT made but again the Ham HTs are easier to reprogram should you want to add a repeater or use it if you travel to another area that you dont have programmed in. I have seen many new hams become disillusioned and drop off the air because the equipment they started out with either didnt meet their needs or was too complicated to use. On the other hand If you are not going to be using it all that much do you really need to blow big bucks on the radio? These are questions that you as an operator really need to evaluate for yourself. In my views the best way is to start with ham equipment and later go to the Motorola if you are so inclined, as you will have a chance to learn more about what is happening in your area, with repeater activity, simplex operations, clubs and so on, A limited channelized rig like the preprogrammed Motos can prevent you from finding this. Even if the rig is set up by someone familiar with what is going on in your area, you are in their hands as to what they think is best as opposed to what you find for yourself. However the Motorola can also be programmed for other frequencies, if you have authorization to use them such as those used by fire departments and so on... So these are decisions that you really need to make for yourself. Personally if you have need for a public service radio I would get both, but again I am an active ham and hold an Extra class license and I use my radios heavily.

[mndless]

Good info... thanks for the reply..

[j3hill]

You can find prick 10's or any other military radios and batteries on ebay if you keep looking. I am putting in my BOV a 40 ch cobra and a marine UHF with 7 ft ant and calling it good.

I'm not quite sure if something happens I will even want to talk to anyone. It's funny that durring katrina cell phones did not work or police two ways. The rise of the CB!!!!

[Paladin]

You can find prick 10's or any other military radios and batteries on ebay if you keep looking. I am putting in my BOV a 40 ch cobra and a marine UHF with 7 ft ant and calling it good.

I'm not quite sure if something happens I will even want to talk to anyone. It's funny that durring katrina cell phones did not work or police two ways. The rise of the CB!!!!

The police two ways and cell phones work pretty much the same way, depending on a central site to manage their connections cell sites for the phones and trunking sites for the police radios, which the hurricane took out. Had the police rigs been backed up with old style technology, similar to common ham radio simplex operation they would have had no problems, but ignorant adoption of high tech without proper backup always shows through. The Municipality I live in went in with the county on a trunked system and has ended up depending on cell phones because of the problems it has given them. There are a number of us in the community that are fighting tooth and nail to get them to return to the old system which would work perfectly and not cost monthly fees to boot.